People say “Mandy you basically on talk about roids,what else you got?” Well I am the Nr.1 RANKED nutritionist on here for a reason.
Ketocels,rawtards and meat guzzlers hate to see me coming. On the surface an all meat diet seems stable,but when you look deeper and understand biochemical mechanisms you’ll truly see what’s wrong with it. We will be discussing multiple aspects and leave out the “pathogen risk” because primals don’t believe in germ theory. So shall we beginn my brethren?
1. Biggest flaw: inflammatory reactions.
View attachment IMG_2722.webp
First we have to uncover what I mean with “inflammatory reactions”,I DO not mean that LDL cholesterol in inherited sense is bad. So when I talk about LDL cholesterol you should read carefully as what turns LDL inflammatory for example.
Red Meat or in general meat is abundant with inflammatory amino acids: Tryptophan, Cysteine and Methionine
In normal amounts,these amino acids do not cause harm in normal amounts yet if your diet primarily consists of meat you will be overloading your body with these specific amino acids which are inflammatory.
People say “Okay Mandy,explain how this works” well it’s simple and it’s all down to peripheral serotonin. Neural Serotonin is responsible for your mood and neurotransmitter regulation, peripheral serotonin is 90% of your total body’s serotonin and peripheral serotonin is thy one who causes downstream inflammatory effects.
Mechanism of Tryptophan-> Serotonin -> Cortisol -> stress dominant inflammation:
Free,rapid absorbing tryptophan (red meat tryptophan)
v
tryptophan gets sensed by enterochromaffin cells in the gut
v
Enterochromaffin cells don’t wait,once high loads of tryptophan is sensed via amino acid sensing GPCRs such as CaSR cause TPH1 upregulation
v
5-HTP upregulation (limited by endotoxin,current cortisol,PUFA,oxidative stress etc)
v
Peripheral serotonin
v
Enterochromaffin cells dump serotonin in following tissues: lamina propia,portal circulation and patelets (which store it)
serotonin and cortisol upregulation:
Serotonin
v
5-HT2 and 5-HT3 receptor upregulation
v
CRH
v
ATCH
v
Cortisol
Result: Serotonin-Cortisol driven inflammation
therefore: LDL becomes inflammatory,because systems are overthrown over balance.
This is why when people stop eating meat they feel relieved,not because they reduced the cholesterol but because they got rid of the inflammation.
Polyunsaturated fatty acids:
Diets high in meat tend to consume unnecessary polyunsaturated fats such as lenolic acid,which is an omega 6 fatty acid. Even omega 3s are inflammatory,any polyunsaturated fat is due to the multiple unstable bonds they have. They usually consume around 1g of DHA & EPA, which according to the RDI is good,but actually causes you harm. Omega 3s have a half life of 2.5 years in the brain,therefore only needing small amounts of refueling,anything above 300-500mg of DHA & EPA would pose unnecessary oxidative stress,it’s unstable as a mitochondrial ATP source.
Surprising thing:Polyunsaturated fat contributes as “enhancement” to Enterochromaffin cells, meaning in almost the same mechanism the outcome is always excess peripheral serotonin and cortisol.
2.Iron overload.
Iron toxicity is something that is not talked about at all,yet is by far one of the further and deeper issues with this form of nutrition. The thing is your circulating iron,your ferritin levels and other Iron markers could be completely fine. But you can’t calculate or test how much iron is actually stored in your LIVER. Why is this dangerous? Accumulation and buildup. You can’t excrete Iron, so easily like water soluble micronutrients such as B12 for example. Iron gets stored more properly than even fat soluble vitamins D,A,K2 for example simply because you can use up Iron but you can barely excrete it.
On blood work:
Ferritin saturation: normal
Circulating iron:low-normal
What dosen’t show in bloodwork= Liver Iron storage:Borderline high
Once the liver storage of iron exceeds its normal capacity,what happens is all of a sudden you’ll get a flood of iron in your blood and then develop iron toxicity. Whats so dangerous in the fact is the thing that an Iron toxicity and Iron deficiency are extremely similar in symptoms,people’s natural reaction is to consume more and more iron,WHICH MAKE THINGS WORSE!
What happens during Iron toxicity?
-Catalyzes and impairs Fenton reactions
-Increases lipid preoxidation
-impairs mitochondria
-increases inflammatory signaling
In worse cases:
Excess Iron feeds pathogens->suppression of the immune system->damages gut barrier-> CANDIDA.
Your heart is literally the most iron storing organs in your body,just imagine how much oxidative stress will be locally in the heart muscle.
2.Nutrient overload & deficiency at the same time.
Imagine overshooting and being deficient at the same time according to the RDI. This is the case here.
Meat diet are abundant and overfilled with:
-K2
-A
-B12 (harmless but unnecessary in such huge amounts)
-Iron
-B6 (also mostly harmless)
But they lack:
-B1
-B2
-B3 (Not all the time)
-B5
-E
-Ascorbic acid (C)
-SF
-RS3
-Potassium
-Magnesium
-Zinc (will be explained shortly)
-Calcium (will also be explained later)
-Total Carbohydrates
To explain as to zinc,is that the overload of Iron will mostly throw off metal ratios such as the iron-zinc ratio. B1 and B2 can be gotten off pork,but not everyone eats pork everyday and B vitamins should be in daily intake. Missing important minerals and electrolytes and also pre-biotic triggers that help our gut microbiome to produce short chain amino acids butyrate,propionate and acetate. There’s not much to say honestly,you can analyze Goatis’ “full day of eating” in 2018 and you’ll see that I’m right here. Calcium will be explained in the next section.
3.Nutrient competition in absorption.
Here we will be also discussing calcium which I promised. Many people can’t comprehend,that nutrients such as calcium vs iron compete in absorption,also ones like Vitamin A and Vitamin D do simply because similar or same electrolyte channels are used to absorb these nutrients.
So here’s why you can be calcium deficient in a raw diet:
Meal: Raw steak with 400ml of raw milk
Consumption: At the same time
Result: Calcium and iron absorption is paired due to the fact they have to absorb at the same time and getting impaired via Nurtient competition.
So yes,you can all the vitamins in your raw liver for example,nutrient competition will tax a large portion of your nurtients.
4.Protein availability & utilization.
Yes, you can literally have poor protein utilization for building new tissues even if you consume over 180g on average.
If you barely run on carbs,or don’t run on carbs at all your body will use the amino acids you consume during the day (a portion) to convert into glucose.
So:
180g protein intake-> gluconeogenesis-> converted a portion into glucose-> left with approx 30% of protein left of what you consumed.
It wouldn’t be a issue,since you could consume more protein but: Your daily fat intake from meat greatly limits how much protein you can consume during the day,so you’re capped at a certain amount unless you reduce the total fat intake.
5. Glucose is a better fuel source.
https://looksmax.gg/threads/why-gly...tp-outcomes-than-fat-oxidation-high-iq.14074/
https://looksmax.gg/threads/carbs-will-forever-mog.13916/
It would be too to explain in this thread,these threads explain thoroughly.
So, that was mostly it. I appreciate the ones who read everything. Holy high effort,I wonder if there are any primals or carnivores here to counteract my arguments and I’d be curious to hear.
Me personally I don’t eat meat,my main protein and fat sources are dairy and eggs,and I hit every single RDI daily. I am a Ray Peat,Dairy centric vegetarian who mostly consumes fruits for carbs.
Anyways baby,if you need advice in anything:
Ketocels,rawtards and meat guzzlers hate to see me coming. On the surface an all meat diet seems stable,but when you look deeper and understand biochemical mechanisms you’ll truly see what’s wrong with it. We will be discussing multiple aspects and leave out the “pathogen risk” because primals don’t believe in germ theory. So shall we beginn my brethren?
1. Biggest flaw: inflammatory reactions.
View attachment IMG_2722.webp
First we have to uncover what I mean with “inflammatory reactions”,I DO not mean that LDL cholesterol in inherited sense is bad. So when I talk about LDL cholesterol you should read carefully as what turns LDL inflammatory for example.
Red Meat or in general meat is abundant with inflammatory amino acids: Tryptophan, Cysteine and Methionine
In normal amounts,these amino acids do not cause harm in normal amounts yet if your diet primarily consists of meat you will be overloading your body with these specific amino acids which are inflammatory.
People say “Okay Mandy,explain how this works” well it’s simple and it’s all down to peripheral serotonin. Neural Serotonin is responsible for your mood and neurotransmitter regulation, peripheral serotonin is 90% of your total body’s serotonin and peripheral serotonin is thy one who causes downstream inflammatory effects.
Mechanism of Tryptophan-> Serotonin -> Cortisol -> stress dominant inflammation:
Free,rapid absorbing tryptophan (red meat tryptophan)
v
tryptophan gets sensed by enterochromaffin cells in the gut
v
Enterochromaffin cells don’t wait,once high loads of tryptophan is sensed via amino acid sensing GPCRs such as CaSR cause TPH1 upregulation
v
5-HTP upregulation (limited by endotoxin,current cortisol,PUFA,oxidative stress etc)
v
Peripheral serotonin
v
Enterochromaffin cells dump serotonin in following tissues: lamina propia,portal circulation and patelets (which store it)
serotonin and cortisol upregulation:
Serotonin
v
5-HT2 and 5-HT3 receptor upregulation
v
CRH
v
ATCH
v
Cortisol
Result: Serotonin-Cortisol driven inflammation
therefore: LDL becomes inflammatory,because systems are overthrown over balance.
This is why when people stop eating meat they feel relieved,not because they reduced the cholesterol but because they got rid of the inflammation.
Polyunsaturated fatty acids:
Diets high in meat tend to consume unnecessary polyunsaturated fats such as lenolic acid,which is an omega 6 fatty acid. Even omega 3s are inflammatory,any polyunsaturated fat is due to the multiple unstable bonds they have. They usually consume around 1g of DHA & EPA, which according to the RDI is good,but actually causes you harm. Omega 3s have a half life of 2.5 years in the brain,therefore only needing small amounts of refueling,anything above 300-500mg of DHA & EPA would pose unnecessary oxidative stress,it’s unstable as a mitochondrial ATP source.
Surprising thing:Polyunsaturated fat contributes as “enhancement” to Enterochromaffin cells, meaning in almost the same mechanism the outcome is always excess peripheral serotonin and cortisol.
2.Iron overload.
Iron toxicity is something that is not talked about at all,yet is by far one of the further and deeper issues with this form of nutrition. The thing is your circulating iron,your ferritin levels and other Iron markers could be completely fine. But you can’t calculate or test how much iron is actually stored in your LIVER. Why is this dangerous? Accumulation and buildup. You can’t excrete Iron, so easily like water soluble micronutrients such as B12 for example. Iron gets stored more properly than even fat soluble vitamins D,A,K2 for example simply because you can use up Iron but you can barely excrete it.
On blood work:
Ferritin saturation: normal
Circulating iron:low-normal
What dosen’t show in bloodwork= Liver Iron storage:Borderline high
Once the liver storage of iron exceeds its normal capacity,what happens is all of a sudden you’ll get a flood of iron in your blood and then develop iron toxicity. Whats so dangerous in the fact is the thing that an Iron toxicity and Iron deficiency are extremely similar in symptoms,people’s natural reaction is to consume more and more iron,WHICH MAKE THINGS WORSE!
What happens during Iron toxicity?
-Catalyzes and impairs Fenton reactions
-Increases lipid preoxidation
-impairs mitochondria
-increases inflammatory signaling
In worse cases:
Excess Iron feeds pathogens->suppression of the immune system->damages gut barrier-> CANDIDA.
Your heart is literally the most iron storing organs in your body,just imagine how much oxidative stress will be locally in the heart muscle.
2.Nutrient overload & deficiency at the same time.
Imagine overshooting and being deficient at the same time according to the RDI. This is the case here.
Meat diet are abundant and overfilled with:
-K2
-A
-B12 (harmless but unnecessary in such huge amounts)
-Iron
-B6 (also mostly harmless)
But they lack:
-B1
-B2
-B3 (Not all the time)
-B5
-E
-Ascorbic acid (C)
-SF
-RS3
-Potassium
-Magnesium
-Zinc (will be explained shortly)
-Calcium (will also be explained later)
-Total Carbohydrates
To explain as to zinc,is that the overload of Iron will mostly throw off metal ratios such as the iron-zinc ratio. B1 and B2 can be gotten off pork,but not everyone eats pork everyday and B vitamins should be in daily intake. Missing important minerals and electrolytes and also pre-biotic triggers that help our gut microbiome to produce short chain amino acids butyrate,propionate and acetate. There’s not much to say honestly,you can analyze Goatis’ “full day of eating” in 2018 and you’ll see that I’m right here. Calcium will be explained in the next section.
3.Nutrient competition in absorption.
Here we will be also discussing calcium which I promised. Many people can’t comprehend,that nutrients such as calcium vs iron compete in absorption,also ones like Vitamin A and Vitamin D do simply because similar or same electrolyte channels are used to absorb these nutrients.
So here’s why you can be calcium deficient in a raw diet:
Meal: Raw steak with 400ml of raw milk
Consumption: At the same time
Result: Calcium and iron absorption is paired due to the fact they have to absorb at the same time and getting impaired via Nurtient competition.
So yes,you can all the vitamins in your raw liver for example,nutrient competition will tax a large portion of your nurtients.
4.Protein availability & utilization.
Yes, you can literally have poor protein utilization for building new tissues even if you consume over 180g on average.
If you barely run on carbs,or don’t run on carbs at all your body will use the amino acids you consume during the day (a portion) to convert into glucose.
So:
180g protein intake-> gluconeogenesis-> converted a portion into glucose-> left with approx 30% of protein left of what you consumed.
It wouldn’t be a issue,since you could consume more protein but: Your daily fat intake from meat greatly limits how much protein you can consume during the day,so you’re capped at a certain amount unless you reduce the total fat intake.
5. Glucose is a better fuel source.
https://looksmax.gg/threads/why-gly...tp-outcomes-than-fat-oxidation-high-iq.14074/
https://looksmax.gg/threads/carbs-will-forever-mog.13916/
It would be too to explain in this thread,these threads explain thoroughly.
So, that was mostly it. I appreciate the ones who read everything. Holy high effort,I wonder if there are any primals or carnivores here to counteract my arguments and I’d be curious to hear.
Me personally I don’t eat meat,my main protein and fat sources are dairy and eggs,and I hit every single RDI daily. I am a Ray Peat,Dairy centric vegetarian who mostly consumes fruits for carbs.
Anyways baby,if you need advice in anything:
