Now, firstly, why did I make this thread
Because too many people don't know wtf they are hopping on
OH AROMATASE INHIBITOR WOW I BECOME TALL BHAI!! BUT ALSO MAYBE SERM BECAUSE SERM ALSO LOW ESTROGEN SO I BECOME TALL OFF SERM BHAI!!!
Yet dont know how these work exactly
So I'll go over it today
Firstly
(skip this if you already know) MECHANISMS OF ACTION
For both serms and AI’s
(btw I hope EVERYONE here knows est is the thing that ages and closes your plates and bones if not please do like 2 Google searches and come back)
AIs competitively bind to the cytochrome P450 enzyme aromatase (CYP19A1). This enzyme is responsible for the rate-limiting step in estrogen biosynthesis: the conversion of androgens (like testosterone) into estrogens. By inhibiting this enzyme, AIs reduce the body's actual estrogen production. [Source 2].
SERMs - The "Receptor Blockers": SERMs, however dont stop the body from producing estrogen; they bind directly to ER’s (ERα and ERβ) at the cellular level because they are “selective.” Their shape changes depending on the tissue they bind to. And they can recruit corepressors to act as a estrogen antagonist in some tissues, or recruit coactivators to act as a est agonist in others. Systemic levels remain normal or even become elevated when on a SERM, but the target tissues can't “see” est [Source 3].
We all know why and how ais affect height, less conversion to est less est less bone aging, and plate fusion. If interested, go to [Source 4]. But what about SERMs and, in certain scenarios, tamoxifen
While yes, tamoxifen can delay bone age, however, its pharmacological profile severely harms the rate og growth. Clinical studies show that tamoxifen acts systemically to suppress IGF-1. Additionally, tamoxifen is TOXIC to your growth plate, inducing apoptosis *programmed cell death) In) in the resting zone chondrocytes [Source 6].
Therefore, tamoxifen is basically negligible when it comes to heighmaxxing save that shit for your gyno boyo.
Additonally Raloxifene in mammalian animal models (rabbits/rats) actually stunted height due to the body thinking that there was a surge in estrogen and therefore accelerating bone age. This has not been proven to be the case with humans, however, why the fuck would you still take this?? Just hop on ais
TLDR for all those dnr spammers
DONT USE SERMS FOR HEIGHMAXXING
1. Estrogen's Role in Epiphyseal Fusion (Baseline):
Grumbach, M. M. (2000). Estrogen, bone, growth, and sex: a sea change in conventional wisdom. Journal of Pediatric Endocrinology and
Metabolism, 13(Suppl 6), 1439-1455. [PMID: 11154000]
2. Aromatase Inhibitors - Mechanism and Predicted Height Gains (Hero et al.):
Hero, M., Norjavaara, E., & Dunkel, L. (2005). Inhibition of estrogen biosynthesis with a potent aromatase inhibitor increases
Predicted adult height in boys with idiopathic short stature: a randomized controlled trial. The
Journal of Clinical Endocrinology &
Metabolism, 90(12), 6396–6402. [PMID: 16189252]
3. SERMs - Molecular Mechanism of Action:
Riggs, B. L., & Hartmann, L. C. (2003). Selective estrogen-receptor modulators — mechanisms of action and application to clinical
practice. New England Journal of Medicine, 348(7), 618-629. [PMID: 12584371]
4. Aromatase Inhibitors - Maintenance of Growth Velocity via Androgens:
Hero, M., et al. (2005). Letrozole treatment and pubertal growth in boys. Acta Paediatrica, 94(1), 108-110. [PMID: 15858969]
5. Tamoxifen - Pediatric Dosing and Predicted Height Claims:
Kreher, N. C., Eugster, E. A., & Shankar, R. R. (2005). The use of tamoxifen to improve height potential in short pubertal boys.
Pediatrics, 116(6), 1513-1515. [PMID: 16322179]
6. The SERM Flaw - IGF-1 Suppression and Chondrocyte Apoptosis:
Karimian, E., et al. (2008). Tamoxifen and raloxifene differ in their effects on longitudinal bone growth and growth plate
chondrocytes. Journal of Endocrinology, 198(2), 293-300. [PMID: 18492803] (This is the critical study proving why Tamoxifen stunts growth velocity despite delaying bone age).
Disclaimer
This is all hypothetical and satire, and the beliefs of the people in this community do not reflect my own
And as always, have a good day
Because too many people don't know wtf they are hopping on
OH AROMATASE INHIBITOR WOW I BECOME TALL BHAI!! BUT ALSO MAYBE SERM BECAUSE SERM ALSO LOW ESTROGEN SO I BECOME TALL OFF SERM BHAI!!!
Yet dont know how these work exactly
So I'll go over it today
Firstly
(skip this if you already know) MECHANISMS OF ACTION
For both serms and AI’s
(btw I hope EVERYONE here knows est is the thing that ages and closes your plates and bones if not please do like 2 Google searches and come back)
AIs competitively bind to the cytochrome P450 enzyme aromatase (CYP19A1). This enzyme is responsible for the rate-limiting step in estrogen biosynthesis: the conversion of androgens (like testosterone) into estrogens. By inhibiting this enzyme, AIs reduce the body's actual estrogen production. [Source 2].
SERMs - The "Receptor Blockers": SERMs, however dont stop the body from producing estrogen; they bind directly to ER’s (ERα and ERβ) at the cellular level because they are “selective.” Their shape changes depending on the tissue they bind to. And they can recruit corepressors to act as a estrogen antagonist in some tissues, or recruit coactivators to act as a est agonist in others. Systemic levels remain normal or even become elevated when on a SERM, but the target tissues can't “see” est [Source 3].
We all know why and how ais affect height, less conversion to est less est less bone aging, and plate fusion. If interested, go to [Source 4]. But what about SERMs and, in certain scenarios, tamoxifen
While yes, tamoxifen can delay bone age, however, its pharmacological profile severely harms the rate og growth. Clinical studies show that tamoxifen acts systemically to suppress IGF-1. Additionally, tamoxifen is TOXIC to your growth plate, inducing apoptosis *programmed cell death) In) in the resting zone chondrocytes [Source 6].
Therefore, tamoxifen is basically negligible when it comes to heighmaxxing save that shit for your gyno boyo.
Additonally Raloxifene in mammalian animal models (rabbits/rats) actually stunted height due to the body thinking that there was a surge in estrogen and therefore accelerating bone age. This has not been proven to be the case with humans, however, why the fuck would you still take this?? Just hop on ais
TLDR for all those dnr spammers
DONT USE SERMS FOR HEIGHMAXXING
1. Estrogen's Role in Epiphyseal Fusion (Baseline):
Grumbach, M. M. (2000). Estrogen, bone, growth, and sex: a sea change in conventional wisdom. Journal of Pediatric Endocrinology and
Metabolism, 13(Suppl 6), 1439-1455. [PMID: 11154000]
2. Aromatase Inhibitors - Mechanism and Predicted Height Gains (Hero et al.):
Hero, M., Norjavaara, E., & Dunkel, L. (2005). Inhibition of estrogen biosynthesis with a potent aromatase inhibitor increases
Predicted adult height in boys with idiopathic short stature: a randomized controlled trial. The
Journal of Clinical Endocrinology &
Metabolism, 90(12), 6396–6402. [PMID: 16189252]
3. SERMs - Molecular Mechanism of Action:
Riggs, B. L., & Hartmann, L. C. (2003). Selective estrogen-receptor modulators — mechanisms of action and application to clinical
practice. New England Journal of Medicine, 348(7), 618-629. [PMID: 12584371]
4. Aromatase Inhibitors - Maintenance of Growth Velocity via Androgens:
Hero, M., et al. (2005). Letrozole treatment and pubertal growth in boys. Acta Paediatrica, 94(1), 108-110. [PMID: 15858969]
5. Tamoxifen - Pediatric Dosing and Predicted Height Claims:
Kreher, N. C., Eugster, E. A., & Shankar, R. R. (2005). The use of tamoxifen to improve height potential in short pubertal boys.
Pediatrics, 116(6), 1513-1515. [PMID: 16322179]
6. The SERM Flaw - IGF-1 Suppression and Chondrocyte Apoptosis:
Karimian, E., et al. (2008). Tamoxifen and raloxifene differ in their effects on longitudinal bone growth and growth plate
chondrocytes. Journal of Endocrinology, 198(2), 293-300. [PMID: 18492803] (This is the critical study proving why Tamoxifen stunts growth velocity despite delaying bone age).
Disclaimer
This is all hypothetical and satire, and the beliefs of the people in this community do not reflect my own
And as always, have a good day
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